This poll could be answered very differently depending on if you live in the US or the rest of the world. Medical costs + bike costs, vs just bike costs.
"Which Fail Looked the Most Expensive?" is legit the dumbest poll ever. But you're totally right, the answer all depends on if you live in America or not where you can be bankrupted by medical costs.
@suspended-flesh: EH, as far as I understand, most Americans still pay some kind of deductible or co-pay, regardless of how good their insurance is, so it's always going to be medical costs + bike costs.
@jayacheess: That is true. I do pay $15 for an office visit and up to $100 for ER visits.I don't know how I became the only commenter on PB waging war against haters of the US healthcare system, but here we are. It does indeed suck for most, especially those with multiple dependents.
@suspended-flesh: You know how much we pay for office or ER visits? Or anything else? Literally nothing. I mean, whatever it's your "freedom" to pay for healthcare I guess, but I'll keep that money in my pocket, thanks.
I think theres probably quite a few small hospitals near busy UK bike parks where the folk in A&E would like to see mangled mountain bikers have to cough up a few quid for their self inflicted wounds. I’m not saying they should but folk do seem to take it for granted they’ll get fixed up if a day of danger goes wrong.
@Ridgeline5: No, not free, but significantly cheaper than US healthcare, and we don't have to think about a bill when we need medical care.
In fact, the US government pays DOUBLE what Canada does, and we get universal healthcare out of it. This is BEFORE you pay individually for health insurance.
So yeah, your taxes go toward propping up your for-profit healthcare system, that you then have have to turn around and pay into a second time.
@jayacheess: it would cost $992 per month for me to ensure my family of 4 through my fancy tech-company corporate insurance plan. I still have deductibles (I think $3k?) and co-pays. You also have to use “in network” hospitals, meaning I couldn’t go to just any hospital if I want my insurance to cover the bill.
Eye care and dental is additional on top of that, maybe $100 or so a month, and only pays a portion of the bill (~80%) for anything other than a routine checkup.
But I think my plan gives me like 5 “complementary” therapist sessions per year? Isn’t that ironic.
@suspended-flesh: Right, but he didn't say 'free'. I think he was referring to having to pay out of pocket for healthcare, rather than it being covered by taxes. Like, if I call the police to report a crime, it costs me nothing on the spot. But yes, my taxes pay for the police department.
@suspended-flesh: It's true that we all pay one way or another, but one of the big differences (if not the biggest) is the amount companies charge for drugs. In the UK (and I believe it's the same in Canada) we have legislation stopping companies from charging extortionate amounts for the drugs they supply, whereas in the US that's not the case. I can buy Zovirax cold sore cream (yes, I'm herpes ridden) for around £6 for a 5g tube. In 2015 a Canadian tourist payed $95 through his travel insurance for that same 5g tube of cream when vacationing in LA. His insurance company was then charged $2,532.80. www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-lazarus-20150306-column.html If people can't see just how f*cked that is I really don't know what to say.
@teedubya: Totally agree that the for-profit healthcare system in the US is completely out of control. Luckily, I only go in for repairs so far. Big Food makes us sick and Big Pharma sells the cure.
"Let Food Be Thy Medicine and Medicine Be Thy Food.” This oft-quoted phase spoken by Hippocrates around 400 BC has never been more relevant."
@teedubya: in USA we have politicians who stop government from interfering with extortion, and Whoopi Goldberg would love for you to get hooked up with some Nurtec. I highly recommend Cigna's automated claim rejection software
@suspended-flesh: not coming at you personally but i have 2 defendants and pay a little over 500 a pay period for my companies insurance. That’s 26 times a year. So about 13000 plus meeting my 8k deductible. I mean, it’s worth it in the grand scheme of healthcare costs, and i agree, the us gets dumped on for our system but it’s what we got.
@suspended-flesh: If only our county were taught applied mathmatics more comprehensively. The math doesn't lie.
The US on a per capita basis pay 2.5x more money for healthcare than any other country in the world (#1 country ranked for healthcare quality is France they pay the second most, 40% of what we pay, ouch). Our health outcomes (an imperfect measure of overall health and how well healthcare works) aren't even in the top 30 of all countries. We are right next to Cuba, a country we have embargoed medical technology against for 50+ years.
In the US you pay for healthcare directly (deductibles), and indirectly via taxes (billions go to healthcare systems and insurance companies every year), and via your employer who pays 10's of thousands a year per employee and also has to hire/dedicate HR staff to negotiate and get plans and coverage every year with insurers. If you put all of the direct and indirect costs together, the US health system is objectively the worst on the planet for a high income country for our entire population. However, much like most things in the US, at the individual level you can pay your way to better specialty care if you have enough money.
@Klimbnbike: Yes, the employee contribution can be brutal with dependents.. The only good thing is that we generally don't have to wait to be seen by a physician. I have EU friends with some pretty nasty stories of bureaucratic entanglements and long waits for simple things. I just like to push back a bit because this is a global meme. You can't watch an IG clip of people doing dangerous things (like the clips from the Tick Ditch skate get together making the rounds, for example) without some trollbot asking how you can do that in the US given the state of health care. You cannot be denied healthcare in the US if you walk into an ER. I went this way for many years before I grew up and got a real job or two. Like prisons, I believe that healthcare should not be a for-profit system. Capitalism is like cancer in that its only goal is growth.
@joecrosby: $1k per month? I go for the PPO - any provider and it's $1300 a month for me and wife, with deductibles. $300 of it I pay, $1000 employer pays.
We'd rather eat our own sh#t than get the slightest whiff of anyone we don't think deserving enough is getting something from our tax dollars.
@suspended-flesh: do you speak from the perspective of navigating the medical system with a life threatening, chronic health condition? I am and it is definitely not life affirming care we are receiving. Also try to see a specialist in New Mexico. The joke is that it takes minimum a year. I got referred in network by the largest provider in New Mexico to an ophthalmologist and the soonest appointment they had was ten months out. Same story for endocrinologist. When you need routine healthcare to survive, our system makes it easier in no way. And I’ve lived in NM, CA, and OR.
@Kebabroll: The hospital in Hobart certainly saw a significant uptick in serious MTB injuries after Maydena Bike Park opened. But several of the senior ED and ICU consultants are mountain bikers, so I don't think "we need co-payment" was the first thought going through their minds.
@JWadd: yup, $1k out of MY pocket. I can’t afford that, so we don’t do it.
Living in America look like this: Health Insurance $12k Car Insurance $2k Mortgage $36k Utilities $4k Food $6k (super low estimate here) Misc shit you gotta pay for $5k
Thats $65k a year just to exist. That doesn’t include saving, 401k contributions, school funds for kids, car payments, student loans, eating out, entertainment, recreation, Christmas presents… nothing. Better pray your car doesn’t die or you get broke off.
To actually live comfortably with financial security as a family of 4, bare minimum you gotta make $100k+ a year. It’s crazy. I am so incredibly fortunate to have the life I have (thanks to family help, a lot of luck, and working my ass off 60+ hours per week), but my god, it’s insane out there.
@JWadd: God bless you, Wadd, and especially your wife. Her organs are the battleground for a new tomorrow and a new yesterday. She sounds like a good cook, too! Paying more for insurance is a first step towards the final solution
I love the two clips with kids giving commentary. The first one was super-excited and the second added a prescient explosion effect just before the crash.
Agreed. I think 29 she had some energy dissipated by hitting the slope on the angle. #30... I bet he wasn't even breathing during the aftermath. That was hard. Real hard.
@endurojeff29bzh: I built that section of trail. I doubt if you could make it that far down the trail riding like that. I'm guessing he got messed up in the compression from the rock roll at the start of the clip and then couldn't recover his position down the steep run out. If he hadn't veered offline into that wheel trap he'd of ride it out too.
Actually I hit him on the head. I managed to brake a little on the jump when I saw him going over the bars and cased that jump so my speed wasn´t that fast anymore. Could have been much worse.
(honestly, if Vail doesn't contribute or donate something to that health clinic, they absolutely should)
In fact, the US government pays DOUBLE what Canada does, and we get universal healthcare out of it. This is BEFORE you pay individually for health insurance.
So yeah, your taxes go toward propping up your for-profit healthcare system, that you then have have to turn around and pay into a second time.
www.cihi.ca/en/national-health-expenditure-trends-2022-snapshot#:~:text=Among%2038%20countries%20in%20the,United%20States%20.
Eye care and dental is additional on top of that, maybe $100 or so a month, and only pays a portion of the bill (~80%) for anything other than a routine checkup.
But I think my plan gives me like 5 “complementary” therapist sessions per year? Isn’t that ironic.
I can buy Zovirax cold sore cream (yes, I'm herpes ridden) for around £6 for a 5g tube. In 2015 a Canadian tourist payed $95 through his travel insurance for that same 5g tube of cream when vacationing in LA. His insurance company was then charged $2,532.80.
www.latimes.com/business/la-fi-lazarus-20150306-column.html
If people can't see just how f*cked that is I really don't know what to say.
"Let Food Be Thy Medicine and Medicine Be Thy Food.” This oft-quoted phase spoken by Hippocrates around 400 BC has never been more relevant."
The US on a per capita basis pay 2.5x more money for healthcare than any other country in the world (#1 country ranked for healthcare quality is France they pay the second most, 40% of what we pay, ouch). Our health outcomes (an imperfect measure of overall health and how well healthcare works) aren't even in the top 30 of all countries. We are right next to Cuba, a country we have embargoed medical technology against for 50+ years.
In the US you pay for healthcare directly (deductibles), and indirectly via taxes (billions go to healthcare systems and insurance companies every year), and via your employer who pays 10's of thousands a year per employee and also has to hire/dedicate HR staff to negotiate and get plans and coverage every year with insurers. If you put all of the direct and indirect costs together, the US health system is objectively the worst on the planet for a high income country for our entire population. However, much like most things in the US, at the individual level you can pay your way to better specialty care if you have enough money.
Each day I pray that the children take their AR-15s out of the charter school classrooms and into the boardrooms. Be safe be well
We'd rather eat our own sh#t than get the slightest whiff of anyone we don't think deserving enough is getting something from our tax dollars.
Living in America look like this:
Health Insurance $12k
Car Insurance $2k
Mortgage $36k
Utilities $4k
Food $6k (super low estimate here)
Misc shit you gotta pay for $5k
Thats $65k a year just to exist. That doesn’t include saving, 401k contributions, school funds for kids, car payments, student loans, eating out, entertainment, recreation, Christmas presents… nothing. Better pray your car doesn’t die or you get broke off.
To actually live comfortably with financial security as a family of 4, bare minimum you gotta make $100k+ a year. It’s crazy. I am so incredibly fortunate to have the life I have (thanks to family help, a lot of luck, and working my ass off 60+ hours per week), but my god, it’s insane out there.
Best dressed?
Most Dadly?
Most irritating hype man?
see above.